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    Grits...Clairborn webby site.

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    kemokae

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    Grits...Clairborn webby site.

    Post  kemokae on Wed 02 Jun 2010, 3:48 am

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    Grits

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    Age : 63
    Location : Alabama

    Re: Grits...Clairborn webby site.

    Post  Grits on Fri 04 Jun 2010, 12:54 pm

    Thank you kemokae, but I found out I don't descend from the Claiborne's after all. Once I was able to subscribe to ancestry, I found out that I had the wrong grandparents for my great grandmother and that was the line that went back to Claiborne and way beyond so it took me a while to get all that deleted and start over.

    Now the line doesn't go back so far (yet) and ends with Delbridges. I haven't had time to investigate them yet. Another name shows up in this line that I've never heard before...Gwaltney. I don't even know the origin of that name, so I've got more work to do...lol

    I've had a weird work schedule lately and have had to do some leg work concerning my son so haven't had the time I'd like to work on this or anything for that matter, but hope to work on it some today. I have less than two weeks left on my subscription and doubt I'll be able to renew it for a bit...sigh

    kemokae

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    Re: Grits...Clairborn webby site.

    Post  kemokae on Fri 04 Jun 2010, 7:56 pm

    Those are indeed different surnames, I can't say off hand I've seen them, kind of like this "Brazee/Braizer" family I'm dealing with...on later descendents, and then I found an clue..you see, I know many times my Lawson's couldn't tell the whole story "correctly" if they tried, to do so would reveal their "true" nature...at this time it was an deadly thing to do. There does appear to been an slaughtering going on between the family lines and the Pope. "In July 1209, the Crusaders marched into "Beziers" and with no difficulty, took the city and killed everyone in it, men, women, children, and priests, and the place put to the torch. Between 15,000 and 20,000 people were slaughtered, there were only 200 heretics. These heretics were an group of Cathars...whom refused to authority of the Pope. It was taken on St. Mary Magdalene's Day..the heretics/Cathars claiming she was the concubin of Jesus. The church of course said contrary...as she was supposedly an converted "whore" in their books...it was her feast day...I beleive this town was in FRance. The town was forwarned ahead of time for its citzens to leave and they backed the Cathars. If some of them got away, it's unknown..as the Pope simply said to "Kill, Kill them all!" Those whom carry the secret of the "Holy Grail" it is hinted at that they see these "holy ones" in visionary apparations at times...for they are supposedly "immortal" beings..and this is nothing new, there are reports all over the world of people seeing the Virgin Mary also...proclaimed often to be an "miracle" of its own. But you see, for those whom think that Jesus was the manifested body of "God"...whom supposedly took the Virgin Mary as his wife..it leaves an taste of "holy" adultry to the name of "God" for "Jesus" to be akin to Mary Magdalena. So naturally the "pope" would squealch any such thoughts. Though these heretics and many more say that they know..because they saw their "child" after the Crucification in France protected by Jesus associates...and the church has kept that very quiet all these years...even if it became "murder" to do so. I read this in the book "The Templar Revelation" by Lynn Picknett and Olive Prince, an well sourced book I might add also. I guess in some ways it my knowledge from "Dove" whom is connected and thier being French...I got looking into this name..as George Washington is connected to an Frencheman named Bienville in his Ohio Land company in 1749. There is this "thing" also concerning the
    "Black Madonna". One would think it's the "Ethopian" lineage involved with
    the lineage of "David" prior perhaps...they also claim they have the "Tablets" of the 10 Commandments..with the "Ark of the Convent" also. One can only say that if
    there were survivors, that they would of kept the town history "connected" to them
    in name, as was so often done...destroying the very thing the Pope wanted kept quiet...and hushed. As I said, this is an "living" history...an immortal one. This story with an explanation can be found on pages 87-89 in this book. Within 3 generation years, these people would of come to "America" most likley..and were carriers of the history of these Cathars. The Cathars fought with the church saying they were far removed from the Jesus movement of life simplicity, benvolent aide, and non-wealth as it was. That also incited the Pope through the many years..to destroy them...many an time he did an excellent job at it, never really winning though in the end...no wonder the tarrot cards were made to show him to be the true "Anti-Chirst" and not the personification of the word of "God"...only another "figure-head" at most. My first notes of any connection to them with Rossyln Chapel comes in 1314..with Robert Bruce being intiated into Scotland..and my English "Wessignton's (WAshington) is whom "Robert the Bruce" was said
    affliated with in doing this. The Lawson's were neighbors back then, but Rosslin
    Chapel (built by the Sin Clair's) came into being around 1450 to 1480. For the
    templars, it was the end of their "initiation rites" and there they became one in
    "spirit" with God..and he was able to manifest within them to do his bidding on earth. Thier GRand master was Hughes de Payens, whom married Catherine St. Clair...her family was prominent in both Scotland and France in the 11th century..and the Lawson's whom were the English ruling family of "Planegent" would later lose the crown in the "War of Roses" to thier cousin "Richard"...and its then they became "Lawson" surnamed...an adoption from the many "Sheriff's" in the Northcumberland English border area.(See "Robinhood" also)
    It says that Robert Bruce over-came the Englsih Crown in the Battle of Bannockburn with Templar help in the year of 1314 also. Later an Peter Plantard,
    went to France and changed his name to Sinclair. These are the very beginnings of
    the Templars concerning France to England/Scotland areas...and the fulfillment of their Sacred rites in Masonary. Sinclair's are in this book just mentioned also.
    One can only wonder if "Peter Plantard" was the earthly embodiment of the Apostle
    Peter. Let me remind you also, the Lawson's are probably internationally married
    back in those days as rulers of the Crown, which was common amoung the ruling class to keep peace, if they didn't remarrying unto themselves, and that most "Masons"
    are the "Cream of the Crop" in their trade work. It seems to me quite an few of them were invovled in setting up our country's foundation back then in many different ways also. Most likely though.... "transporation" and "building" and "communication" were paramount..with "defense" of them all included. Between my mother's and my dad's and hubby's mother and dad's family they were all the time
    marrying back and forth, and makes my work harder at times, not easier. For they
    have this kind of "secrecy" to them all at times. For that reason alone I hope they
    have not messed up my birth certificate I sent away for recently. I suposedly have an copy of it already, if I can find it these days amid everything else. Hope this helps you some, you better get to working night and day to get the time schedule in
    on your genealogy site.I apparently have to get some kind of software to be able to
    read many of the Library notes where information and documents are kept, so joingin it doesn't do me any good until that is taken care of first...I am unsure though just "What" it is I need to read them at this time...they have an long list of choices to persue. I have no idea which one is better over another. I would ask my other genealogist's if I had my email server, but I don't as yet. Probably never will from the looks of things either.

    kemokae

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    Re: Grits...Clairborn webby site.

    Post  kemokae on Sat 05 Jun 2010, 12:55 am

    And....a bit of added knowledge about Beziers...from wikipedia...other information said about it, was that it is... in this era..one of the dirtiest towns on the globe. It's claim to fame is the yearly famous bull-fight it holds there in August and winemaking. It's in France, the area of Laugandoc, in Sw France, it sits on an sandy bluff above the Orb River which connects to the Mediterrean Sea. It's an old city, going back to before the Celts. It has an old Roman Road built there that includes an one of an kind Aqueduct system. It was re-founded by the Roman's as an colony for it's veterans around the year 36/37. Excavactions found wine bottles dating back to that era. It was occupied by the moors 720 to 752, during the 10th to 12th centuries an Viscount of Bezier's family ruled it through sucession for 142 years. Then came the Albigansion Crusade by Pope Innocent III, in 1209 slaughtering the Cathars and the whole town as mentioned in the pervious post. It's Church of St. Nagaire, was later restored again. Louis Napoleon's "coup de'etat" in 1851, fired into protestors there and caused an bit of an squirmish and battle also. It has been able to keep it's history alive through it's trade routes of the Roman Road and it's wine-making.

    While I was out looking for possible connections of the "Cathars" to the Masonic Lodge in Europe I came across this in kind of an "Whose Who in Royalty"..
    Fredrich II, Emperor sent Herman Von Salar to the Pope and upon his return, received an marriage proposal. The intended bride was 12 year old Yolanda de Brienne, heredity Queen of Jerusalem. (Parents Jean de Brienne and Maria de Monferranto...said King and Queen of Jerusalem 1211-1225)..the Pope helped it would encourage Frederich II to go on Crusade. He was reluctant and had to be talked into it, it was another 2 years before that was achieved, but he finally married her with
    at him 31 years of age, and her 14 years old..she later presented him with an son, named Konrad and died by the next month..at age 16,.. May 1228. There was also
    much talk about an flirtation with an cousin of hers also..Frederich was the King of Sicily 1197-1250. I looked this up in my Holy Grail Book and could not find the
    successors of the Jews, but Jesus "ministry" had much changed the world, that it took on an complete change from the church as was known back in those days. None the less, many of these Royal groups I read were intitated often into an "second "birth" at age 12, particularly by the Merovingians..not marriage....though they were often betrothed though even as infants sometimes. This group I've gotten into some legacy on, they kind of "pop up" from no-where, said from an princess being impregananted by an "monster" on the beach..these days a lot sounding of an UFO Alein encounter...and back then said perhaps one of the
    so called "Fisher Kings"..as seen in the Egyptian temples. Supposedly there were an
    council of 12 of them. This book says they were highly enlighted beings, and some
    say they may of lived at the famed "Atlantis"..from an pervious world era culture that escaped the fate of Atlantis...if not true "alein"..and Jesus is said to be able to have "occult power-understanding".. simliar to them. They are sometimes said immortals. The book of "Bloodline of the Holy GRail" by Laurence Gardner has quite a bit about them in ways in concerning their religious influence. There has always been the suggestion of genetic manipulation in mankind's early history. But it is interesting that in this case they seem to know the "Fisher King" and his wife by name, if nothing otherwise, that concerns this dynasty in this book. As to the "Jewish" church after the crucification of Jesus, I've not dealt with to many times as yet to know it's history...as to the "High Priest's". Supposedly by one of my Masonary books it was an "sect" guarded by the Templar Knights...and yet that makes no sense what so ever, considering their vow of oath to "God" and their rituals...over any church doctrine in general. I would think they protected the Apostle's more so, if not the "Fisher King's" and of course the supposed daughter of Mary Magadalena and Jesus..named Sarah...said taken to France. It may be
    that this "Turk" surnamed family I have surrounding ours is an Jewish line at some time. But for the most part..it is Solomon's Temple that the Templar Knights went to defend..not the Jews....and supposedly they convinscated many of it's treasures to take with them during the Crusades back to Scotland, England, Ireland and even unto "America" in it's colonial days. But the main theme here is the ensence and
    the spirit of "God" they are suppose to be keeping alive...transferring it from Jerusalem to Rossylin Chapel. Before I go..this book has an lineage for the Sinclair's and it was Henry Sinclair whom came to "America" in 1398, and then passed away...exactly like my grandfather generations back only different era and area..his coming out to Oregon. Henry is an longtime name in our family...before the present family ruling England these days. Just as William, the original Sinclair legacy. I had to put that one in, as my ancestor's told me that our legacy would be built from "within" and that is how I would recognize it for its "truth". It will be something that others can not change, nor steal.. and only those whom have the inner-knowledge will know. God knows his breathen? I go for now. I hope you don't mind all this as you asked about it over in Bopp's, I'm no expert, but
    have read cosniderably and hope soemwhere along the line this can help you to understand them. There is the "history" only part, there is the ritual-religion part, and there is the "spirit" part of it all. You must know all three aspects to get the whole picture.
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    Grits

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    Age : 63
    Location : Alabama

    Re: Grits...Clairborn webby site.

    Post  Grits on Sat 05 Jun 2010, 1:07 pm

    Regarding the Sinclairs, it's hard to separate fact from fiction. That is why I was asking for books on the subject. Legend has it that they WERE Templar Knights but then I ran across what seemed to be a "factual" website that said they actually testified AGAINST the Templar Knights when King Philip IV rounded them all up. That is the part I would like to get to the bottom of.

    As for the Davinci Code stuff. It makes great fiction, but is not something I believe to be fact.

    My line comes from Henry Sinclair I who married Jane Halyburton (any connection to Halleburton???...lol) and their daughter Elizabeth St. Clair (evidently she went back to the older form of the name) who married John Drummond. Then it goes down through Drummonds, Flemings, Keelings, and etc. The Flemings and Keelings I have on two different lines on my dad's side. It's very confusing, but the Sinclair line seems more solid than the other line. I need to do more research on the union of Keeling and Fleming to sort it all out.

    I did do some research yesterday but it was on my mother's side where I am having a lot more difficulty finding information. There are a lot of dead ends on her side. I only have through the sixth generation on her side and some of the sixth part is questionable. My father side goes back reliably to the 12th generation on my father's last name and then back 32 generations on the Sinclair line.

    Mom wants to give me the money to renew for another month because she wants me to find out more about her family, but honestly I don't know much else I can do on her side...sigh This side involves Ballentines, Fullers, Hugheys, Cannons, and Stricklands. They must have been low key people as you can't find much. The Ballentines were Scottish and married into the Dutch/Germans in North Carolina so I have a good bit on them. My Fuller line is the MOST puzzling and one I have spent a lot of time on. Supposedly it goes back to Ezekiel Fuller of Isle of Wight, VA, but I'm having trouble on one link of that. There is a lot of discussion in the genealogy forums as to whom Ezekiel belongs to. Some say the Mayflower Fullers and some say not...and I don't think anyone really knows the answer. Regardless he was here very early in the formation of this country.

    Gotta run, going to do a bit of research, then some errands, and then down to my grandson's 8th birthday party...man they grow sooooo fast!

    Enjoying the conversation as usual....

    ...and I have come across a LOT of Adairs recently and a few Lawsons. Give me a few of the main names to look out for...

    Grits
    Smile

    kemokae

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    Re: Grits...Clairborn webby site.

    Post  kemokae on Sat 05 Jun 2010, 10:56 pm

    Perhaps Phillip had an knife across their throat?...I wouldn't believe it right now...you would well know that it always "pays to live another day" to get your just resorts in life, no maater hwo you have to do it..do more research work? My templar book has an list of Phillips in it...in one case the half-brother of Herod(the half he killed in order to commit adultry)...in another an apostle of Jesus(hum..new to me..have to read about him someday)...no "King Phillip" though. This book says the name of Phillip is an non-Jewish greek name..for the most part..why I thought it was Spanish I have no idea. I can't imagine Sinclairs having any Greek leanings if they were Templar Knights...but I've found myself wrong before. Maybe the "other side" wrote it....an everyone knows they never look favorable to anyone but themselves generally. (Well, we dont' say that out openly though..winks*)

    Ballentines I knew, are related to my daughter in-law, but very distantly...and she was an very short an stocky "nurses aide" where I worked. I had an Strickland that worked for me over summer one time also, they were kind of "back to the land" type people..lived off bear meat at times, which is rather "rare" these days, as they are hard to find at Mt. Hood to hunt...so are the deer for deer meat though. They comprised of an group of people in town all related to each other..that were hard workers and not to much formal education...but controlled things by upholding each other in ways as an sort of invisble "union" of an kind. They had "smarts" though as to "surviving" and making the most of things. Some you liked, some you didn't.. depending on how you were related I suppose...your contact with them. Probably very old lineage though...and I find out that the longer they were in the past, the less moneyed they seem to be these days. It is pehaps the wars, the helping others, the march across the country...it all adds up over time. Oregon was never "founded" on the wealth of its incoming people off wagon trains...known as pioneers. This was an hardy bunch of people though. They anchored deep into the soil to claim it part of the United States later on.

    Some more update for you though...as I try to find out more surrounding George
    Washington ties and the Templar Knights...I looked up his Beinville association that
    was French...he turns out to be hired by Canada's Govenor to run the Mississippi
    and Ohio River areas to keep "French" ties to it..most his legacy is out of Lousiana
    as he founded New Orleans later on. I got to reading about "his gay way" of doing things and wondered what that meant...apparently he thought he couldn't protect it
    all..so he placed stone "tablets" up and down the rivers stating they belonged to France, and were put in place for people to know whom the ground belonged to at that time, along with an date...clever. It might of saved an skirmish or two. Through the years various people have found them and turned them in...only the Indians turned one in still in pristine condition though.

    On the Bresier's of France...whom turned into the Brazer's to Brasher's...they are
    planning an 8 vol. book series about their family. I kept one line of information on them that might be of family significance directly..then I went to looking up
    the name in general...though this group's original ancestor is spelled the same
    (Bresier) and came over at the first of the founding of Jamestown, and like many moved north into Maryland around the time of the "Jamestown Massacre" indian raids...with Lord De La Ware....whom later claims his own colony named after him..Delaware State. New Englader's went south and Virginians went north with incoming groups to locations in-bwteen both colonies.

    Then I went to my "bio" book on George Washington and it mentions Inn-keeper Jean
    Pierre Brissot...whom is anything but most likley, though he may of owned the place, I doubt he ever worked in it...born 1754..died 1793, he came
    over from France and is an world reknown historian/political author of our American Rev. and apparently advisor and financial backer to George Washington on the side line..his "group" called the "Girondists" were part of an Revolutionary elite during the French Revolution...whom finacially backed that movement. I would say this group was very simliar to our "Illuminati" these days. Though they called themselves connected to an series of other social/political clubs of the day also, like the Jacobins and the Bretons. Clubs whom had an three groups from within that included the "noble class" and the clergy and the higher "middle" caste of people..ususally tradesmen. But as for Brissot he left behind all kind of journals on the founding of the country through-out its Revolution and it's money system "set-up" and general history...as apparently he knew George Washington, and one helped the other in so many unspoken words...they were "friends" by aquaintence...and lived the same time frame in life. Nothing points to any Templar Knight's being involved...but I'm sure there most likely were. In part they started out of France.

    I tried to access records from the oldest "Masonic" Lodge in our nation..that out
    of Richamond, Va. and couldn't because I don't have this reader converter software I need...they apparently have an record of them by name in the early days. I was able to link Brasher's with the Lewis and Jones/Ball family by marriage to Washington. I know the Ball family has an line named Baloi...in New England later called "Ballou" that married into the Larkin side. This is an Royal lineage from both England and France that combined through marriage at one time...and another line shows an affliation with perhaps more roots northern yet. John Balloi took the crown of Scotland for the Plantagent family in 1292. He descended from Prince David, Earl of Huntington. England's Edward I stated however, whomever ruled..they had better be prepared to rule under the auspices of the King of England. The other side of the coin by the Scotch themselves wanted Robert the Bruce (backed by the Washington "English" side) and need I say...we all know whom won out..Robert Bruce. I had an hard time even finding something nice said about this "John" so no wonder the family came over here...so did the Lawson's when they lost their Royal crown also. My templar book says that the Paris libraries have very old manuscripts from around 600 about Mary Magadelene being brought over after the Jesus crucification and the purpose for that. It was written up in an hymn and widely circulated by one 17h century Jesuit priest named Jean Bolland. I have not seen this "hymn" but I bet I know what it concerns in part...from an TV special called "The lost tribes"...there is an area of France that has master tradesmen to it, near the north coast somewhere, that are said today to be the last of reknown to work with metals..particularly "Gold" and in the days of "Revelation" and during the "Armedgeddon" they will wield the weapons for God's army. It will not be until that time the "lost tribes" are once again truly "found" and reunited. This tv special says its very near..and I saw that some 10 to 15 years ago. That concludes about all I've got to say for now on all these people. I did find information to help me in bits and parts though as I searched along, but I have to take some time off, nothing is getting done around the house here much. Weather providing, I need
    to paint an section of fence out front..enjoy....Later.

    kemokae

    Posts : 120
    Join date : 2010-02-23

    Re: Grits...Clairborn webby site.

    Post  kemokae on Sat 05 Jun 2010, 11:44 pm

    I'm not sure that Dan Brown has all the answers, though he tells an terrifc story...
    but in ways I can see the purpose of Mary Magdalene also...but not as is commonly thought...for one thing, Lazara's family name was Magadalene...and many scholars say he married Martha's sister "Mary" not the "whore" that sought redemption from
    the mercy of Jesus, and I wonder about her "spirit" of being an carry over from the days of BAL..the Lord of Fertilty. He came from present day Iraq..which is suppose to also be an "star-gate" to heaven. Rather he could of been another one of the
    12 "fisher-king's" I have no idea...as they say the word "bal" translates into
    Owner of the land. Back then the "temple" had what was called "priestess whores"
    and they ordained an mortal man into marriage and his human sexually with his spiritual union of soul to God...so that the mixture of "love" can abide by both sects...that of mankind and of God...complete but separate in thier ways. If there
    was an "whore" I find it hard by what Jesus says...beyond "mercy" to not maybe see
    Mary Magdalene as an re-incarnated past temple "priestess" and when he says..in so
    many terms...let the highest/purist amoung you be the first to destroy...and then
    he turns to her an he says...your "free" to go now...that perhaps he is in effect
    really releasing her from her re-incarnation from the past, by destroyng it instead, so she can move on in her soul growth...in an spiritual way.
    Myself I think why she went back to him to be an devout convert...she was certainly "free" to go as she pleased. She now joins the ministry of the Lord through Abraham...in worship/devotion rather then "Bal"...in fertilty. You know I see things differently then most people do..why I have no idea, I just "do" and very
    often it is not told to me, just "understood" to be so sometimes. I see in the way
    things were handled...an complete "balance" between the church and the Lord in what
    was done. That is what I see often in Jesus very words..if you have an red letter edition bible, and read it, you will see what I mean. The world was born with the good and the bad, the postiive and the negative, but it takes an "master
    teacher" to speak his words perfectly in use to "balance" both apsects at once without harming one side or the other. Jesus does that. I have noticed it since I was an little kid. You can't find anyone more insincere then the churches "love" of mankind and doing just the opposite some days to prove it. No, in God's realm there is no such thing as "tough" love...just in mankind's..and that's because he learned it from his parents, who learned it from...and it's ages old now. Nor is there such an thing as overtly sweeteness/kindness for wrong doing either..for its gives an reward of real persecution by hard knocks in life also. But there is an "blance" in the teachings of Jesus that show us the way..if we listen to them. It takes an very wise person to see that for what it is. Some spiritual people say there is an council of 12 sets under "God" and perhaps they were the "fisher's king's" and
    why some say that Jesus is one also...only he sits at the right side of his father.
    For he is "one" with him and yet separate also. This is an subject of both "spiritual" and the realm of the earthly. What does matter is by all accounts,
    we have good things going on for the most part. With the birth of "Sarah"..said to be his daughter.. Even "Bal" is not denied the realm of "life"...or an empty void
    for the future. Our planets out in space are to me looking pretty devoid of "life"
    so I can see why they would understand that "creation" through living things as we
    know them were to be held in high degree...and "sacred"..but not into the realm of
    whoreom and lust and mis-use..false worship. Maybe at one time "Atlantis" truly was the home of the "fisher king's on earth...half human..half "spirit" beings.

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